openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
84 messages Options
12345
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Alexey Eromenko
Hi All !

I believe everyonw has read that:
http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2008091902235NWSW

In short:
Today openSUSE's X server crashes if the video card gets upgraded.
After reboot X doesn't start = reformat and reinstall <- That's what
all new users will do.

Do we want this reaction? Obviously not.

BulletProof is a technology that can detect changed video card, and
use VESA driver instead automatically, without the need for using
command-line.

I would like to see this technology adapted for openSUSE.

What do you think of it ?

--
-Alexey Eromenko "Technologov"
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:

> I believe everyonw has read that:
> http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2008091902235NWSW
>
> In short:
> Today openSUSE's X server crashes if the video card gets upgraded.
> After reboot X doesn't start = reformat and reinstall <- That's what
> all new users will do.
>
> Do we want this reaction? Obviously not.
>
> BulletProof is a technology that can detect changed video card, and
> use VESA driver instead automatically, without the need for using
> command-line.
>
> I would like to see this technology adapted for openSUSE.
>
> What do you think of it ?
Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
fool.
And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Alexey Eromenko
> Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
> to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
> fool.
> And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.

This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
before...)

It must be automatic, without touching command-line at all.

--
-Alexey Eromenko "Technologov"
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:

> > Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
> > to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
> > fool.
> > And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.
>
> This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
> Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
> before...)

No. You almost always had run into trouble if you had forgotten to scale
down resolution to 640x480 before the hardware change.

> It must be automatic, without touching command-line at all.

Why not, but it is not necessary.

Serving fools should not be a goal of openSUSE. The quality is in other
areas.


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Felix-Nicolai Müller
In reply to this post by Alexey Eromenko
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Alexey Eremenko schrieb:

>> Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
>> to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
>> fool.
>> And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.
>
> This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
> Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
> before...)
>
> It must be automatic, without touching command-line at all.
>

Not true, you install a new GPU you have to install a new driver (in
Windows), even worth, Windows might not even start anymore if you do not
uninstall the old GPU driver before changing the GPU. Besides, those
running suddenly and intransparently in vesa mode will only start
complaining about their 3d support breaking.
As you pointed out, configuration still needs to be done and I don't see
the difference between calling sax2 from graphical mode or from CLI. It
is exactly the same command as well as it does require excatly the same
workflow.

Felix

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAkjVZfQACgkQaQ44ga2xxArm4ACgrRbOsyEDcbgx2cp04FF7mJby
aT0An2+kH89/iTtBJk1Q3j6ND9IR9mpy
=s1Ux
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Robert Kaiser
Felix-Nicolai Müller wrote:
> As you pointed out, configuration still needs to be done and I don't see
> the difference between calling sax2 from graphical mode or from CLI. It
> is exactly the same command as well as it does require excatly the same
> workflow.

I still think it would be a good idea if we,
   on an X startup failure
     on first X startup after boot,
       when it can't load the video driver,
         would automatically load sax2.

(written with this indentation to make if levels of that decision clear)

At such a sax2 launch, we should note to the user that we failed to
start the graphical interface because of a wrong video driver
configuration, and either auto-detect a working config right away or let
the user choose to do so, which should be able to end up in saving this
new X config and launching into X and xdm, kdm, auto-login or whatever
the user has set his box to.
In any case, we should offer a "Cancel and exit to text mode" which
basically does end up where we end up right now.

This isn't that that much of a "new technology", it's just a
user-friendly way of getting out of an awkward situation - and
technically it's just detecting that series of if cases mentioned above
and launching an already existing application with maybe slightly
adapted UI texts.

OK, I'm saying this as someone who is just a simple user of openSUSE but
someone who knows about open source development and someone who's deep
into open source project organization, and I know the main part of this
is probably "make a patch and submit it for reviews", which I'm unable
to do, so I can't expect it to get magically fixed. I hope I could
present this idea in a form that someone capable of developing it can
understand it, and I hope someone actually interested in seeing this can
come up with a patch and submit it, as it's surely a feature that would
help the openSUSE experience for people not as knowledgeable as us (I
guess anyone daring to try Factory is able to cope with calling sax2
himself, we see worse things than failing kernel boots or failing grub
stag2, to name some that happened to me recently).

Robert Kaiser

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Rajko M.
In reply to this post by Eberhard Moenkeberg
On Saturday 20 September 2008 03:31:42 pm Eberhard Moenkeberg wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
> > I believe everyonw has read that:
> > http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2008091902235NWSW

Alexey, I know that I didn't read that.

> > In short:
> > Today openSUSE's X server crashes if the video card gets upgraded.
> > After reboot X doesn't start = reformat and reinstall <- That's what
> > all new users will do.

Well, those that use Ubuntu, are good candidates.
As a side comment, Ubuntu is good as a first step, but if you want real Linux
you need openSUSE.

> > Do we want this reaction? Obviously not.
> >
> > BulletProof

X

> > is a technology that can detect

Not loaded X server in a first instance, than it can look for reasons.

> > changed video card, and  
> > use VESA driver instead automatically, without the need for using
> > command-line.
> >
> > I would like to see this technology adapted for openSUSE.

I guess it is somewhere on long to do list ;-)
Check bugzilla. Maybe there is already proposed enhancement.
Actually script that is starting X knows very well that server doesn't run.
What is missing is to add attempt to start system
with /etc/X11/xorg.conf.install which is VESA driver based, and tell GUI to
display message about suboptimal graphic driver.

Of course next step would be to develop troubleshooter, and that might be nice
task to start more community involvement in development. Instead of 20th
version of BitTorrent client, 50th text editor, etc.

> > What do you think of it ?
>
> Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
> to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
> fool.
> And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.

Comment is perfectly valid for changed graphic adapter, but there are use
cases where X will not start with configured driver, but instead to fall back
to VESA, or generic driver, or start configuration automatically user will
see terminal screen.

For classic Linux users that is no brainer, but for new guys it is. They are
used to reinstall stuff that gives no clue what to do next, and perfectly
functional text mode doesn't give any clues. The motd is only "Have a lot of
fun ...". Not much to start with, if you see login screen first time.

--
Regards, Rajko
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Andreas Schlehahn
In reply to this post by Alexey Eromenko
Am Samstag, 20. September 2008 13:25:42 schrieb Alexey Eremenko:

> Hi All !
>
> I believe everyonw has read that:
> http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2008091902235NWSW
>
> In short:
> Today openSUSE's X server crashes if the video card gets upgraded.
> After reboot X doesn't start = reformat and reinstall <- That's what
> all new users will do.
>
> Do we want this reaction? Obviously not.
>
> BulletProof is a technology that can detect changed video card, and
> use VESA driver instead automatically, without the need for using
> command-line.
>
> I would like to see this technology adapted for openSUSE.
>
> What do you think of it ?

I ran into this exact problem a while back when I started with Linux (SuSE
9.2, I believe), and I did exactly what you said: reformatting &
reinstalling, getting quite a bit upset. Why did I not just search the
support formus for a solution? Well, I did not have any dealings with the
command line in Linux before, and I did not have another PC available to
search the 'Net.

In my opinion, all that's needed is a hint about what to do. A simple text,
displayed if X does not start or crashes right away.
Something like: "Could not start the graphical environment. Please log in as
root and run 'sax2' from the commandline to detect changed hardware or
drivers."

--
Gruß
Andreas
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Eberhard Moenkeberg
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1



The Saturday 2008-09-20 at 22:44 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg wrote:

>>> Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
>>> to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
>>> fool.
>>> And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.
>>
>> This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
>> Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
>> before...)
>
> No. You almost always had run into trouble if you had forgotten to scale
> down resolution to 640x480 before the hardware change.

No. For that cases you reboot in safemode.

- --
Cheers,
        Carlos E. R.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAkjVh1EACgkQtTMYHG2NR9WmLwCePPldj2sKKdV1ZBLmeXHVf6+Q
o/AAn31z9SUyG/u3yiPE0oWt8dmUwBve
=V7Me
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> The Saturday 2008-09-20 at 22:44 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg wrote:
 

> > > > Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he
> > > > has
> > > > to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a
> > > > fool.
> > > > And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.
> > >
> > > This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
> > > Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
> > > before...)
> >
> > No. You almost always had run into trouble if you had forgotten to scale
> > down resolution to 640x480 before the hardware change.
>
> No. For that cases you reboot in safemode.
Not better than the need to call sax2 by hand, so what do you want to
exclaim?


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Robert Kaiser
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Content-ID: <[hidden email]>


The Saturday 2008-09-20 at 23:25 +0200, Robert Kaiser wrote:

> Felix-Nicolai Müller wrote:
>>  As you pointed out, configuration still needs to be done and I don't see
>>  the difference between calling sax2 from graphical mode or from CLI. It
>>  is exactly the same command as well as it does require excatly the same
>>  workflow.
>
> I still think it would be a good idea if we,
>   on an X startup failure
>     on first X startup after boot,
>       when it can't load the video driver,
>         would automatically load sax2.
>
> (written with this indentation to make if levels of that decision clear)
>
> At such a sax2 launch, we should note to the user that we failed to start the
> graphical interface because of a wrong video driver configuration, and either
> auto-detect a working config right away or let the user choose to do so,
I'd prefer being asked before launching sax2.

- --
Cheers,
        Carlos E. R.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAkjViXcACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UU4wCgiEWrULJVM9OzR39hAY8HYO1l
IOEAmQH2ezF2USN46gRfWMGiXcopdEPN
=DQZa
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> The Saturday 2008-09-20 at 23:25 +0200, Robert Kaiser wrote:
> > Felix-Nicolai Müller wrote:

> > >  As you pointed out, configuration still needs to be done and I don't see
> > >  the difference between calling sax2 from graphical mode or from CLI. It
> > >  is exactly the same command as well as it does require excatly the same
> > >  workflow.
> >
> > I still think it would be a good idea if we,
> >   on an X startup failure
> >     on first X startup after boot,
> >       when it can't load the video driver,
> >         would automatically load sax2.
> >
> > (written with this indentation to make if levels of that decision clear)
> >
> > At such a sax2 launch, we should note to the user that we failed to start
> > the graphical interface because of a wrong video driver configuration, and
> > either auto-detect a working config right away or let the user choose to do
> > so,
>
> I'd prefer being asked before launching sax2.
You see.
Just understand "not working" as "I am asked to run sax2".
In that situation, this thought should come by itself.

Remember: serving fools ...


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Andreas Schlehahn
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1



The Saturday 2008-09-20 at 14:28 -0700, Andreas wrote:

...

> In my opinion, all that's needed is a hint about what to do. A simple text,
> displayed if X does not start or crashes right away.
> Something like: "Could not start the graphical environment. Please log in as
> root and run 'sax2' from the commandline to detect changed hardware or
> drivers."

Plus something like «type "less somefile" to read extended instructions»


Mmm. First time I started with Linux, it took me a week to get X working,
more to get it right. That was SuSE 5.2 or .3. There was no sax or I
didn't know it. Some other program I have forgotten about :-) xconfig?

On some new installs, testing the X mode could crash the install...
leaving the system not fully installed, which is not nice for a novice.
Reboot and reinstall... Thus I always installed to runlevel 3, for many
years. Even now I'm wary of installing in runlevel 5... for no reason.

Things are much easier now :-)

- --
Cheers,
        Carlos E. R.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAkjVi4kACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UK9ACfcPOz0+jV3He4pcFQHM5SFh1G
9MMAn1ZcE+M35olgtXIAzolcrm5zkVlq
=Z2nD
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Felix Miata
In reply to this post by Eberhard Moenkeberg
On 2008/09/20 22:44 (GMT+0200) Eberhard Moenkeberg composed:

> On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:

>> > Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
>> > to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a fool.
>> > And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.

>> This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
>> Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
>> before...)

> No. You almost always had run into trouble if you had forgotten to scale
> down resolution to 640x480 before the hardware change.

In my experience, that was never necessary with W98+. In WinXP at least, it
drops back to no worse than its default 800x600, but is often smart enough to
get at least to 1024x768, and even better with competent DDC/EDID
availability. It won't necessarily find the optimum driver automatically for
the new hardware, but it won't stick you in an unusable state.

>> It must be automatic, without touching command-line at all.

> Why not, but it is not necessary.

Because other distros do it? I just pulled a Fedora 4 (released July 2005)
SCSI HD out of one machine with ET6100 gfxcard the other day to stick in
another with G400 and didn't even think about the video difference. X came
right up in 1024x768 on a CRT. Then I changed its gfx card to a Radeon, and
it did just as well. Mandriva Cooker behaves similarly, on boot
automatically, without asking or opportunity to intervene, creating a brand
new xorg.conf from scratch and saving the old as xorg.conf.old. Knoppix
manages at least 9 times out of 10 to automatically give a working X just by
booting its CD. IIRC, *buntu was competent in this regard last I tested, but
since https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/129910 happened I've touched it little.

My preference would be for SaX2 to come up in interactive mode when new
gfxcard is detected.
--
"Unless the Lord builds the house, its builders labor
in vain." Psalm 127:1 NIV

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Felix Miata wrote:
> On 2008/09/20 22:44 (GMT+0200) Eberhard Moenkeberg composed:
> > On Sat, 20 Sep 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:

> >> > Anyone who is changing his hardware this way and is not aware that he has
> >> > to do some configuration steps (very simple here: just call sax2) is a fool.
> >> > And don't forget: serving fools just creates a new fool - you.
>
> >> This is not true. A lot of users are migrating from Windows - and in
> >> Windows it was always automatic, at least since Windows 95. (maybe
> >> before...)
>
> > No. You almost always had run into trouble if you had forgotten to scale
> > down resolution to 640x480 before the hardware change.
>
> In my experience, that was never necessary with W98+. In WinXP at least, it
> drops back to no worse than its default 800x600, but is often smart enough to
> get at least to 1024x768, and even better with competent DDC/EDID
> availability. It won't necessarily find the optimum driver automatically for
> the new hardware, but it won't stick you in an unusable state.
>
> >> It must be automatic, without touching command-line at all.
>
> > Why not, but it is not necessary.
>
> Because other distros do it? I just pulled a Fedora 4 (released July 2005)
> SCSI HD out of one machine with ET6100 gfxcard the other day to stick in
> another with G400 and didn't even think about the video difference. X came
> right up in 1024x768 on a CRT. Then I changed its gfx card to a Radeon, and
> it did just as well. Mandriva Cooker behaves similarly, on boot
> automatically, without asking or opportunity to intervene, creating a brand
> new xorg.conf from scratch and saving the old as xorg.conf.old. Knoppix
> manages at least 9 times out of 10 to automatically give a working X just by
> booting its CD. IIRC, *buntu was competent in this regard last I tested, but
> since https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/129910 happened I've touched it little.
>
> My preference would be for SaX2 to come up in interactive mode when new
> gfxcard is detected.
Why not, if new pci device is detected.

But at least, you want to have the "best" mode of your device configured,
and that needs your personal intellect.

Remember: serving fools ...


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Vincent Untz-5
Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:28 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :
> But at least, you want to have the "best" mode of your device configured,
> and that needs your personal intellect.

Does it? I don't remember having to configure my graphic card/screen
when I installed this computer.

Vincent

--
Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:28 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :

> > But at least, you want to have the "best" mode of your device configured,
> > and that needs your personal intellect.
>
> Does it? I don't remember having to configure my graphic card/screen
> when I installed this computer.

Really? Lucky one stupid.
Please don't forget the matter.

Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Robert Kaiser
In reply to this post by Carlos E. R.-2
Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> At such a sax2 launch, we should note to the user that we failed to
>> start the graphical interface because of a wrong video driver
>> configuration, and either auto-detect a working config right away or
>> let the user choose to do so,
>
> I'd prefer being asked before launching sax2.

Why? With what I wrote, you can still cancel it easily and have no
changes applied anywhere. Unknowing users are right in the mode where
they can correct the problem by usually just click something like "use
this proposed configuration" or however it's worded and it launches up
their usual graphical system right away. _That_ is user-friendliness.

Robert Kaiser
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Vincent Untz-5
In reply to this post by Eberhard Moenkeberg
Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:44 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :

> Hi,
>
> On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Vincent Untz wrote:
> > Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:28 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :
>
> > > But at least, you want to have the "best" mode of your device configured,
> > > and that needs your personal intellect.
> >
> > Does it? I don't remember having to configure my graphic card/screen
> > when I installed this computer.
>
> Really? Lucky one stupid.
> Please don't forget the matter.

I've read your mail at least 5 times. Can you elaborate? I don't
understand your message here...

Vincent

--
Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: openSUSE and Ubuntu's BulletBroof X

Eberhard Moenkeberg
Hi,

On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:44 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :
> > On Sun, 21 Sep 2008, Vincent Untz wrote:
> > > Le dimanche 21 septembre 2008, à 02:28 +0200, Eberhard Moenkeberg a écrit :
 

> > > > But at least, you want to have the "best" mode of your device configured,
> > > > and that needs your personal intellect.
> > >
> > > Does it? I don't remember having to configure my graphic card/screen
> > > when I installed this computer.
> >
> > Really? Lucky one stupid.
> > Please don't forget the matter.
>
> I've read your mail at least 5 times. Can you elaborate? I don't
> understand your message here...
OK, once again: serving fools just creates a new fool - in this case,
probably not you.


Viele Grüße
Eberhard Mönkeberg ([hidden email], [hidden email])
12345