continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

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continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
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Hello group,

I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying to=20
access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
mechanic stress.

dmesg shows following continously:
[1537682.559487] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result:=20
hostbyte=3DDID_OK driverbyte=3DDRIVER_SENSE
[1537682.559496] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Sense Key : Not Ready [current]
[1537682.559498] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Add. Sense: Logical unit not ready,=20
cause not reportable
[1537682.656688] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Spinning up disk...
[1537683.668046]=20
............................................................................=
..................not=20
responding...
[1537783.093938] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Spinning up disk...
[1537784.104049]=20
............................................................................=
..................not=20
responding...

this can't be the wanted behaviour for any removable storage devices?

Any Hints?

Thank you and have a nice weekend

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

James Knott
On 12/10/2017 07:54 AM, Paul Neuwirth wrote:
> I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying
> to=20
> access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
> mechanic stress.

What's a "floppy drive"?  ;-)

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Paul Neuwirth-3
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On Sunday, 2017-12-10 at 13:54 +0100, Paul Neuwirth wrote:

> Hello group,
>
> I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying to=20
> access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
> mechanic stress.

Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At least
that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.

>
> dmesg shows following continously:
> [1537682.559487] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result:=20
> hostbyte=3DDID_OK driverbyte=3DDRIVER_SENSE

That's not the floppy. It should be "/dev/fd0".


Telcontar:~ # mount -v /mnt/floppy
mount: /dev/fd0 is write-protected, mounting read-only
mount: /dev/fd0 mounted on /mnt/floppy.
Telcontar:~ # ls /mnt/floppy
AUTOEXE2.BAT  AUTOEXEC.BAT  CONFIG.SYS  EGA.CPI  HIMEM.SYS  IO.SYS  KEYBOARD.SYS  MODE.COM  MSCDEX.EXE  MSDOS.SYS  PARTINFO.EXE  PTEDIT.EXE  command.com
Telcontar:~ #




- --
Cheers,
        Carlos E. R.
        (from openSUSE 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" at Telcontar)

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
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On Sunday 2017-12-10 22:11, Carlos E. R. wrote:

>>  Hello group,
>>
>>  I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying to=20
>>  access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
>>  mechanic stress.
>
> Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At least
> that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>
The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI floppy
drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.
>>
>>  dmesg shows following continously:
>>  [1537682.559487] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result:=20
>>  hostbyte=3DDID_OK driverbyte=3DDRIVER_SENSE
>
> That's not the floppy. It should be "/dev/fd0".
Would be nice, to have this enumeration.. but does not work for SCSI and
USB floppy disk drives, but it works for my optical and streamer device
/dev/sr? / /dev/st?.
>
> Telcontar:~ # mount -v /mnt/floppy
> mount:  /dev/fd0 is write-protected, mounting read-only
> mount:  /dev/fd0 mounted on /mnt/floppy.
> Telcontar:~ # ls /mnt/floppy
> AUTOEXE2.BAT  AUTOEXEC.BAT  CONFIG.SYS  EGA.CPI  HIMEM.SYS  IO.SYS
> KEYBOARD.SYS  MODE.COM  MSCDEX.EXE  MSDOS.SYS  PARTINFO.EXE  PTEDIT.EXE
> command.com
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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
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On Monday 2017-12-11 08:34, Paul Neuwirth wrote:

> On Sunday 2017-12-10 22:11, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>
>>>   Hello group,
>>>
>>>   I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying
>>>   to=20
>>>   access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
>>>   mechanic stress.
>>
>>  Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At least
>>  that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>>
> The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI floppy
> drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.
>>>
>>>   dmesg shows following continously:
>>>   [1537682.559487] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result:=20
>>>   hostbyte=3DDID_OK driverbyte=3DDRIVER_SENSE
>>
>>  That's not the floppy. It should be "/dev/fd0".
> Would be nice, to have this enumeration.. but does not work for SCSI and USB
> floppy disk drives, but it works for my optical and streamer device /dev/sr? /
> /dev/st?.
>>
>>  Telcontar:~ # mount -v /mnt/floppy
>> mount:   /dev/fd0 is write-protected, mounting read-only
>> mount:   /dev/fd0 mounted on /mnt/floppy.
>>  Telcontar:~ # ls /mnt/floppy
>>  AUTOEXE2.BAT  AUTOEXEC.BAT  CONFIG.SYS  EGA.CPI  HIMEM.SYS  IO.SYS
>>  KEYBOARD.SYS  MODE.COM  MSCDEX.EXE  MSDOS.SYS  PARTINFO.EXE  PTEDIT.EXE
>>  command.com

it is obviously udevd trying to access:
2017-12-11T08:40:23.514423+01:00 kappa systemd-udevd[7096]: seq 26005
'/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:0a.0/0000:01:06.0/host0/target0:0:3/0:0:3:0/block/sdc'
is taking a long time
2017-12-11T08:41:03.700391+01:00 kappa kernel: [1605883.536057]
...............................................................................................not
responding...
2017-12-11T08:41:03.752509+01:00 kappa kernel: [1605982.903509] sd
0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result: hostbyte=DID_OK
driverbyte=DRIVER_SENSE
2017-12-11T08:41:03.752546+01:00 kappa kernel: [1605982.903514] sd
0:0:3:0: [sdc] Sense Key : Not Ready [current]
2017-12-11T08:41:03.752547+01:00 kappa kernel: [1605982.903516] sd
0:0:3:0: [sdc] Add. Sense: Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable
2017-12-11T08:41:03.852387+01:00 kappa kernel: [1605982.999717] sd
0:0:3:0: [sdc] Spinning up disk...
2017-12-11T08:42:23.514220+01:00 kappa systemd-udevd[7096]: seq 26005
'/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:0a.0/0000:01:06.0/host0/target0:0:3/0:0:3:0/block/sdc'
killed

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Per Jessen
In reply to this post by Paul Neuwirth-3
Paul Neuwirth wrote:

>>>  Hello group,
>>>
>>>  I have on several machines this problem: they are continously
>>>  trying to=20 access the floppy drives. Two drives already
>>>  defective, due to the=20 mechanic stress.
>>
>> Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At
>> least that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>>
> The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI
> floppy drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.

A SCSI floppy-drive?  Wow, I don't remember ever seeing one of those.


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http://www.dns24.ch/ - free dynamic DNS, made in Switzerland.


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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Carlos E. R.-2
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El 2017-12-11 a las 09:12 +0100, Per Jessen escribió:

> Paul Neuwirth wrote:
>
>>>>  Hello group,
>>>>
>>>>  I have on several machines this problem: they are continously
>>>>  trying to=20 access the floppy drives. Two drives already
>>>>  defective, due to the=20 mechanic stress.
>>>
>>> Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At
>>> least that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>>>
>> The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI
>> floppy drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.
>
> A SCSI floppy-drive?  Wow, I don't remember ever seeing one of those.
Me neither, didn't even know they existed. over USB, yes, I knew, but
never handled one.

I suppose it is correctly connected inside. The cable plug has a
protuberance impeding inserting inverted, but nevertheless, I have seen
them connected inverted: some plugs did not have the notch. And turning
continuously was typical of having the cable inverted.

I can't think of anything else, and with scssi... no, no idea.


- --
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        Carlos E. R.

        (from openSUSE 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" (Minas Tirith))
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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Felix Miata-3
In reply to this post by Paul Neuwirth-3
Paul Neuwirth composed on 2017-12-10 13:54:57 (UTC+0100):
...
Have you tried including broken.modules=floppy on kernel cmdline?
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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
On Monday 2017-12-11 10:25, Felix Miata wrote:

> Paul Neuwirth composed on 2017-12-10 13:54:57 (UTC+0100):
> ...
> Have you tried including broken.modules=floppy on kernel cmdline?
I will try on next reboot, but i just tried modprobe floppy:
[1702089.760122] floppy0: no floppy controllers found


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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Carlos E. R.-2
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El 2017-12-12 a las 11:25 +0100, Paul Neuwirth escribió:

> On Monday 2017-12-11 10:25, Felix Miata wrote:
>
>>  Paul Neuwirth composed on 2017-12-10 13:54:57 (UTC+0100):
>>  ...
>>  Have you tried including broken.modules=floppy on kernel cmdline?
> I will try on next reboot, but i just tried modprobe floppy:
> [1702089.760122] floppy0: no floppy controllers found

Which is correct, you don't have a /floppy/. you have something on SCSSI.

There must be some other driver.

- --
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        Carlos E. R.

        (from openSUSE 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" (Minas Tirith))

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

ianseeks-4
In reply to this post by Paul Neuwirth-3
On Sunday, 10 December 2017 12:54:57 GMT Paul Neuwirth wrote:
 
> I have on several machines this problem: they are continously trying to=20
> access the floppy drives. Two drives already defective, due to the=20
> mechanic stress.

Could it be detecting a water leak and its a spin-dry cycle?  :)



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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Mark Hounschell
In reply to this post by Carlos E. R.-2
On 12/11/2017 04:04 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Content-ID: <[hidden email]>
>
>
> El 2017-12-11 a las 09:12 +0100, Per Jessen escribió:
>
>> Paul Neuwirth wrote:
>>
>>>>>  Hello group,
>>>>>
>>>>>  I have on several machines this problem: they are continously
>>>>>  trying to=20 access the floppy drives. Two drives already
>>>>>  defective, due to the=20 mechanic stress.
>>>>
>>>> Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At
>>>> least that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>>>>
>>> The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI
>>> floppy drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.
>>
>> A SCSI floppy-drive?  Wow, I don't remember ever seeing one of those.
>
> Me neither, didn't even know they existed. over USB, yes, I knew, but
> never handled one.
>

I've worked with SCSI floppies back in the early 90's. Not on PCs
though. I doubt seriously that the Linux kernel knows how to handle
these devices properly.

You say you have several machines doing this. Have you ever, on any
Linux machine, actually been able to use these SCSI floppy drives?

Mark

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
On Tuesday 2017-12-12 19:31, Mark Hounschell wrote:

>>  El 2017-12-11 a las 09:12 +0100, Per Jessen escribió:
>>
>>>  Paul Neuwirth wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>   Hello group,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>   I have on several machines this problem: they are continously
>>>>>>   trying to=20 access the floppy drives. Two drives already
>>>>>>   defective, due to the=20 mechanic stress.
>>>>>
>>>>>  Try reversing the cable to the drive (pin 1 at the wrong side). At
>>>>>  least that's what happened to mine... Now it apparently works.
>>>>>
>>>>  The mainboard does not have a floppy controller, so I use an SCSI
>>>>  floppy drive, it is working with a floppy disk inserted.
>>>
>>>  A SCSI floppy-drive?  Wow, I don't remember ever seeing one of those.
>>
>>  Me neither, didn't even know they existed. over USB, yes, I knew, but never
>>  handled one.
>>
>
> I've worked with SCSI floppies back in the early 90's. Not on PCs though. I
> doubt seriously that the Linux kernel knows how to handle these devices
> properly.
>
> You say you have several machines doing this. Have you ever, on any Linux
> machine, actually been able to use these SCSI floppy drives?
>
Yes, it does work... one second...
[1734685.977032] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Spinning up disk...
[1734686.988075]
...............................................................................................not
responding...
[1734786.379534] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Read Capacity(10) failed: Result:
hostbyte=DID_OK driverbyte=DRIVER_SENSE
[1734786.379542] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Sense Key : Not Ready [current]
[1734786.379545] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Add. Sense: Logical unit not ready,
cause not reportable
[1734786.476723] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Spinning up disk...
[1734787.488072] .............ready
[1734800.372199] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] 2880 512-byte logical blocks: (1.47
MB/1.41 MiB)
[1734800.373939] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Write Protect is off
[1734800.373944] sd 0:0:3:0: [sdc] Mode Sense: 37 88 00 08
[1734800.388515] sdc: detected capacity change from 0 to 1474560
[1734800.541066]  sdc:
# mount -t auto -vo ro /dev/sdc mnt
mount: /dev/sdc mounted on /root/mnt.
# mount
/dev/sdc on /root/mnt type vfat
(ro,relatime,fmask=0022,dmask=0022,codepage=437,iocharset=iso8859-1,shortname=mixed,errors=remount-ro)

It is complete same behaviour also on USB floppy disk drives (those were
the ones, which didn't survive. The SCSI floppy disk drive does not spin
up without disk inserted.
By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but are
traded for horrific prices.. ;)
without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..
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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Dave Howorth-3
On Tue, 12 Dec 2017 20:33:34 +0100 (CET)
Paul Neuwirth <[hidden email]> wrote:
> It is complete same behaviour also on USB floppy disk drives (those
> were the ones, which didn't survive. The SCSI floppy disk drive does
> not spin up without disk inserted. By the way I am looking for a
> cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but are traded for horrific
> prices.. ;) without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old
> drives working..

I'm confused. I thought it was SCSI drives that were failing? Now
they're working but USB drives are failing? Which is it?

The actual drives are the same regardless of the interface they are
equipped with, no? So just buy any drive and fit your interface.

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Paul Neuwirth-3
On Tuesday 2017-12-12 22:06, Dave Howorth wrote:

>Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2017 22:06:05
>From: Dave Howorth <[hidden email]>
>To: [hidden email]
>Subject: Re: [opensuse] continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive
>
> On Tue, 12 Dec 2017 20:33:34 +0100 (CET)
> Paul Neuwirth <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> It is complete same behaviour also on USB floppy disk drives (those
>> were the ones, which didn't survive. The SCSI floppy disk drive does
>> not spin up without disk inserted. By the way I am looking for a
>> cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but are traded for horrific
>> prices.. ;) without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old
>> drives working..
>
> I'm confused. I thought it was SCSI drives that were failing? Now
> they're working but USB drives are failing? Which is it?
maybe, we got a bit off the topic. Problem are not non-working drives,
but that udevd continuosly tries to access (spin up) drives, without
disk inserted. That should'nt be so on any removable media drives.
Also are some tasks slowed down, waiting for something udevd does,
extreme example is calling yast bootloader.. which takes several (tens?)
minutes.
>
> The actual drives are the same regardless of the interface they are
> equipped with, no? So just buy any drive and fit your interface.
>
>

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Per Jessen
In reply to this post by Paul Neuwirth-3
Paul Neuwirth wrote:

> By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but
> are traded for horrific prices.. ;)
> without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..

Buy an old PC?  



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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Felix Miata-3
Per Jessen composed on 2017-12-13 07:25 (UTC+0100):

> Paul Neuwirth wrote:

>> By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but
>> are traded for horrific prices.. ;)
>> without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..

> Buy an old PC?                                            
Not necessarily that old, depending on your definition of "old". New PCs and
motherboards at least as recently as 2009 were still shipping with ISA bus
floppy controllers. Examples:

Socket LGA775 Intel:
<http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=413>

<https://www.ebay.com/itm/Gigabyte-GA-G41M-ES2L-Socket-LGA775-microATX-Motherboard-Perfect-Condition/332484364593>

Also LGA775 Intel:
<https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAYZ69W1755>
<http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_desktop/esuprt_optiplex_desktop/optiplex-760_service%20manual_en-us.pdf>

I have the last, with 3.5" floppy, though a SFF model in which a standard 5.25"
floppy drive could not physically fit.
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 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Per Jessen
Felix Miata wrote:

> Per Jessen composed on 2017-12-13 07:25 (UTC+0100):
>
>> Paul Neuwirth wrote:
>
>>> By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but
>>> are traded for horrific prices.. ;)
>>> without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..
>
>> Buy an old PC?
>
> Not necessarily that old, depending on your definition of "old". New
> PCs and motherboards at least as recently as 2009 were still shipping
> with ISA bus floppy controllers. Examples:

I tend to think "old" once they're less than SFr100 on ebay/ricardo.

><http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_desktop/esuprt_optiplex_desktop/optiplex-760_service%20manual_en-us.pdf>
>
> I have the last, with 3.5" floppy, though a SFF model in which a
> standard 5.25" floppy drive could not physically fit.

We have recently begun upgrading office PCs to Lenovo S10 - they also
have an FDD interface, as well as the slots for a 3.5" or 5.25" floppy
drive.  Mind you, the fdd interface is blocked by the graphics card :-)



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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Knurpht-openSUSE
In reply to this post by Felix Miata-3
Op woensdag 13 december 2017 08:25:22 CET schreef Felix Miata:

> Per Jessen composed on 2017-12-13 07:25 (UTC+0100):
> > Paul Neuwirth wrote:
> >> By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but
> >> are traded for horrific prices.. ;)
> >> without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..
> >
> > Buy an old PC?
>
> Not necessarily that old, depending on your definition of "old". New PCs and
> motherboards at least as recently as 2009 were still shipping with ISA bus
> floppy controllers. Examples:
>
> Socket LGA775 Intel:
> <http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=413>
>
> <https://www.ebay.com/itm/Gigabyte-GA-G41M-ES2L-Socket-LGA775-microATX-Mothe
> rboard-Perfect-Condition/332484364593>
>
> Also LGA775 Intel:
> <https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAYZ69W1755>
> <http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_desktop/esuprt_optipl
> ex_desktop/optiplex-760_service%20manual_en-us.pdf>
>
> I have the last, with 3.5" floppy, though a SFF model in which a standard
> 5.25" floppy drive could not physically fit.

Don't know about Paul, but in my perception 2009 is old. My "old" server/
workstation is from 2008, motherboard has a floppy connector, but the case
allows either a floppy drive or a CD/DVD device. ( and 6 disks ).

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Re: continous access on/spinning up of floppy drive

Knurpht-openSUSE
In reply to this post by Per Jessen
Op woensdag 13 december 2017 08:51:28 CET schreef Per Jessen:

> Felix Miata wrote:
> > Per Jessen composed on 2017-12-13 07:25 (UTC+0100):
> >> Paul Neuwirth wrote:
> >>> By the way I am looking for a cheap 5.25" SCSI FDD.. they exist, but
> >>> are traded for horrific prices.. ;)
> >>> without ISA and FDC I do not know how to get my old drives working..
> >>
> >> Buy an old PC?
> >
> > Not necessarily that old, depending on your definition of "old". New
> > PCs and motherboards at least as recently as 2009 were still shipping
>
> > with ISA bus floppy controllers. Examples:
> I tend to think "old" once they're less than SFr100 on ebay/ricardo.
>
> ><http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_desktop/esuprt_optip
> >lex_desktop/optiplex-760_service%20manual_en-us.pdf>>
> > I have the last, with 3.5" floppy, though a SFF model in which a
> > standard 5.25" floppy drive could not physically fit.
>
> We have recently begun upgrading office PCs to Lenovo S10 - they also
> have an FDD interface, as well as the slots for a 3.5" or 5.25" floppy
> drive.  Mind you, the fdd interface is blocked by the graphics card :-)

ROTFL, same for my server/workstation. So, NVIDIA card out, CD/DVD device out
and I could have a floppy drive.
Sorry to say so, but I see absolutely no reason to return to such media.

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openSUSE Board Member
openSUSE Forums Team

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