Writing a small book... what should I use?

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Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
out. Any recommendations?

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

John Andersen-2
On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> out. Any recommendations?
>

If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless.
Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook.
Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers.

If others are going to submit significant amounts, then maybe a wiki would
be useful.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Thomas Hertweck
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke


On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> out. Any recommendations?

You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know
about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.

Th.
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Stuart Tanner-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.

Stuart

Sent from my iPhone

On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> out. Any recommendations?
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> To contact the owner, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Carl Hartung-2
In reply to this post by Thomas Hertweck
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
Thomas Hertweck <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> > I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> > seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this
> > well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh
> > each section out. Any recommendations?
>
> You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't
> know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
>
> Th.

I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
http://www.zim-wiki.org/

hth & regards,

Carl
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
In reply to this post by Stuart Tanner-2
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote:

> Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.
>
> Stuart
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> > seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> > intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> > out. Any recommendations?
> >
> > --
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> > To contact the owner, e-mail: [hidden email]
> >
The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others
will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may
have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

John Andersen-2
On 1/9/2012 3:31 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:

> On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote:
>> Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke<[hidden email]>  wrote:
>>
>>> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
>>> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
>>> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
>>> out. Any recommendations?
>>>
>>> --
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>> To contact the owner, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>
> The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others
> will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
> there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may
> have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.
>

Latex is more about typesetting than writing, and its aimed mostly at
technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go down that path.

Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in
OOo and Libre Office.

You need something that is transportable if others are to edit. And its best if
chapters are separate documents, allowing multiple concurrent editing.

Its too bad that Google Docs is at such a primitive state, because wit would
be good for collaborative editing if it were a little more advanced.


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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Doug McGarrett
On 01/09/2012 06:41 PM, John Andersen wrote:

> On 1/9/2012 3:31 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
>> On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote:
>>> Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE
>>> books for translation.
>>>
>>> Stuart
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke<[hidden email]>  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
>>>> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
>>>> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
>>>> out. Any recommendations?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>> To contact the owner, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>>
>> The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others
>> will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
>> there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may
>> have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.
>>
>
> Latex is more about typesetting than writing, and its aimed mostly at
> technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go
> down that path.
>
> Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much
> missing/useless in
> OOo and Libre Office.
>
> You need something that is transportable if others are to edit. And
> its best if
> chapters are separate documents, allowing multiple concurrent editing.
>
> Its too bad that Google Docs is at such a primitive state, because wit
> would
> be good for collaborative editing if it were a little more advanced.
>
>
I haven't yet tried installing WordPerfect in Wine, but maybe that would
work, if you have it.

--doug
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Anton Aylward-2
In reply to this post by John Andersen-2
John Andersen said the following on 01/09/2012 06:18 PM:

> On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
>> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
>> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
>> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
>> out. Any recommendations?
>>
>
> If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless.
> Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook.
> Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers.

+1

At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of
characters, places, events, chronology, if *AND I SAY IF* you book is
something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most
authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards.

Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in
the technology than the production of a book.

And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or
formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction.

As John says, focus on the content not the mechanics.

--
If people were really trying to just reduce risk, they would be running
on OpenBSD rather than windows. So what we are generally trying to do is
not really Risk Assessment, but Risk Justification. We don't want to
reduce risk so much as justify why we are allowing our assets to be so
exposed.
  - Bill Royds, 16th September 2005
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Thomas Hertweck
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On 2012-01-10 00:21, Thomas Hertweck wrote:

> You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know
> about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.

LyX smooths that curve. It is the WYMIWYG.

- --
Cheers / Saludos,

                Carlos E. R.
                (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar)
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Anton Aylward-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
Roger Luedecke said the following on 01/09/2012 06:31 PM:
> The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others
> will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
> there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may
> have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.

Having used KJots my recommendation is

        DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME

If others have to deal with this they your best bet is plain text.

If you need an outliner there are macros for VIM.

--
I have no faith, very little hope, and as much charity as I can afford.
    Thomas H. Huxley
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
In reply to this post by Carl Hartung-2
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:

> On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
> Thomas Hertweck <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> > > I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> > > seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this
> > > well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh
> > > each section out. Any recommendations?
> >
> > You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't
> > know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
> >
> > Th.
>
> I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
> http://www.zim-wiki.org/
>
> hth & regards,
>
> Carl
Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

John Andersen-2
In reply to this post by Anton Aylward-2
On 1/9/2012 4:20 PM, Anton Aylward wrote:
> At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of
> characters, places, events, chronology, if*AND I SAY IF*  you book is
> something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most
> authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards.

I assumed the work was to be more technically oriented for some reason.

There are a several commercial packages used by writers of novels and
such for plot and character management.  You can tell these works, because
the often have way more characters in the plot than is necessary to tell
the story, and the spend way too much time developing the characters of
non-essential characters.

These are the favorite tools of the formula novelists that crank out a
book every 6 months.  Basically if the Author's name is printed larger
on the cover than the title of the novel, you are in this ballpark.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

John Andersen-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
On 1/9/2012 4:25 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:

> On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
>> On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
>> Thomas Hertweck<[hidden email]>  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
>>>> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
>>>> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this
>>>> well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh
>>>> each section out. Any recommendations?
>>>
>>> You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't
>>> know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
>>>
>>> Th.
>>
>> I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
>> http://www.zim-wiki.org/
>>
>> hth&  regards,
>>
>> Carl
> Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
>

But it looks like you could build it from source in about 15 minutes.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 16:28 -0800, John Andersen wrote:

> On 1/9/2012 4:25 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> > On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
> >> On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
> >> Thomas Hertweck<[hidden email]>  wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> >>>> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> >>>> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this
> >>>> well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh
> >>>> each section out. Any recommendations?
> >>>
> >>> You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't
> >>> know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
> >>>
> >>> Th.
> >>
> >> I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
> >> http://www.zim-wiki.org/
> >>
> >> hth&  regards,
> >>
> >> Carl
> > Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
> >
>
> But it looks like you could build it from source in about 15 minutes.
>
> --
> _____________________________________
> ---This space for rent---
I'm not a programmer.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
In reply to this post by Anton Aylward-2
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 19:20 -0500, Anton Aylward wrote:

> John Andersen said the following on 01/09/2012 06:18 PM:
> > On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> >> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> >> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> >> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> >> out. Any recommendations?
> >>
> >
> > If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless.
> > Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook.
> > Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers.
>
> +1
>
> At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of
> characters, places, events, chronology, if *AND I SAY IF* you book is
> something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most
> authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards.
>
> Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in
> the technology than the production of a book.
>
> And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or
> formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction.
>
> As John says, focus on the content not the mechanics.
>
> --
> If people were really trying to just reduce risk, they would be running
> on OpenBSD rather than windows. So what we are generally trying to do is
> not really Risk Assessment, but Risk Justification. We don't want to
> reduce risk so much as justify why we are allowing our assets to be so
> exposed.
>   - Bill Royds, 16th September 2005
Nothing like that really. At most I'll need to track historical
references. I'm writing a political treatise.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Carl Hartung-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 16:25:45 -0800
Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
> > On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
> > Thomas Hertweck <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> > > > I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely
> > > > remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would
> > > > facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual
> > > > outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
> > >
> > > You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you
> > > don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve
> > > though.
> > >
> > > Th.
> >
> > I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
> > http://www.zim-wiki.org/
> >
> > hth & regards,
> >
> > Carl
> Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
>

I'm running openSUSE 11.4 x86_64 and Zim 0.54 here (I just upgraded Zim)

Use the package manager to ensure the prerequisites are installed:

gtk+ >= 2.6
python >= 2.5
python-gtk
python-gobject
python-simplejson (for python < 2.6)
python-xdg (optional, but recommended)
xdg-utils (optional, but recommended)

Download the tarball and decompress it in your home directory.

Add a launcher to your panel...
Name: "Zim - a desktop wiki"
Command: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/zim.py"
Icon: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/icons/zim16.svg"

You're done.

Spend a little time reading the FAQ and related docs on the website.
Play around with it a little bit. If you don't use it for the book you
might just use it for other things, as I do. It's not too simple, not
too complicated... it just gets the job done.

regards,

Carl
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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Roger Luedecke
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 20:02 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:

> On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 16:25:45 -0800
> Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
> > > On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000
> > > Thomas Hertweck <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
> > > > > I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely
> > > > > remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would
> > > > > facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual
> > > > > outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
> > > >
> > > > You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you
> > > > don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve
> > > > though.
> > > >
> > > > Th.
> > >
> > > I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki"
> > > http://www.zim-wiki.org/
> > >
> > > hth & regards,
> > >
> > > Carl
> > Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
> >
>
> I'm running openSUSE 11.4 x86_64 and Zim 0.54 here (I just upgraded Zim)
>
> Use the package manager to ensure the prerequisites are installed:
>
> gtk+ >= 2.6
> python >= 2.5
> python-gtk
> python-gobject
> python-simplejson (for python < 2.6)
> python-xdg (optional, but recommended)
> xdg-utils (optional, but recommended)
>
> Download the tarball and decompress it in your home directory.
>
> Add a launcher to your panel...
> Name: "Zim - a desktop wiki"
> Command: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/zim.py"
> Icon: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/icons/zim16.svg"
>
> You're done.
>
> Spend a little time reading the FAQ and related docs on the website.
> Play around with it a little bit. If you don't use it for the book you
> might just use it for other things, as I do. It's not too simple, not
> too complicated... it just gets the job done.
>
> regards,
>
> Carl
Groovy. I got it installed. For some reason it doesn't want to be pinned
to docky though.

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Charles Philip Chan-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]>
writes:

> I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember
> seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I
> intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section
> out. Any recommendations?

This article should be of interest to you:

http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/tools-create-your-next-great-novel

Charles

--
"It's God.  No, not Richard Stallman, or Linus Torvalds, but God."
(By Matt Welsh)

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Re: Writing a small book... what should I use?

Carl Hartung-2
In reply to this post by Roger Luedecke
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 17:42:45 -0800
Roger Luedecke <[hidden email]> wrote:
8<---- snipped ----
> Groovy. I got it installed. For some reason it doesn't want to be
> pinned to docky though.
>

Um, don't think I can help you there... sorry. I run GNOME and Zim is
parked comfortably in my panel. Did you say which DE you're running?
I'm assuming KDE? What version? Maybe someone more proficient in
oS/KDE setups can help.

Have fun and good luck on your book!

Carl
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