What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

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What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
Listmates,

        A bit unexpected, after my last zypper up -t package, I notice that 'mysql' has
been removed, but I notice that all the mysql dependent libs are still in place:

[07:43 zephyr/home/david] # zypper se mysql | egrep ^i
i | bytefx-data-mysql                 | mono security update
                   | patch
i | libgda-3_0-mysql                  | mySQL Provider for GNU Data Access (GDA)
                  | package
i | libmysqlclient-devel              | mysql security update
                   | patch
i | libmysqlclient15                  | MySQL Shared Libraries
                   | package
i | libmysqlclient16                  | MySQL Shared Libraries
                   | package
i | libmysqlclient_r15                | MySQL Shared Libraries
                   | package
i | libmysqlclient_r16                | MySQL Shared Libraries
                   | package
i | libqt4-sql-mysql                  | Qt 4 MySQL support
                   | package
i | mysql-administrator               | A MySQL Server Management,
Configuration, and Monitoring-> | package
i | mysql-gui-tools                   | Common Files for MySQL GUI Tools
                   | package
i | mysql-query-browser               | A Graphical MySQL Query Shell
                   | package
i | perl-DBD-mysql                    | Interface to the MySQL database
                   | package
i | php5-mysql                        | PHP5 Extension Module
                   | package
i | qt3-mysql                         | MySQL Plug-In for Qt
                   | package
i | ruby-mysql                        | MySQL bindings for Ruby
                   | package


[07:44 zephyr/home/david] # mysql
Welcome to the MariaDB monitor.  Commands end with ; or \g.
Your MariaDB connection id is 3
Server version: 5.1.44-MariaDB-log SUSE MariaDB RPM

Type 'help;' or '\h' for help. Type '\c' to clear the current input statement.

MariaDB [(none)]> use mysql;
Database changed
MariaDB [mysql]> select user,host,password from user;
<snip - table is still there>

        What in the heck is 'MariaDB' and why did it replace mysql?? What difference
does it make to me? I'm sure Maria is a sweet girl, but I was always partial to
mysql -- What gives?

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Robert Schweikert-4


On 05/04/2010 08:59 AM, David C. Rankin wrote:

> Listmates,
>
> A bit unexpected, after my last zypper up -t package, I notice that 'mysql' has
> been removed, but I notice that all the mysql dependent libs are still in place:
>
> [07:43 zephyr/home/david] # zypper se mysql | egrep ^i
> i | bytefx-data-mysql                 | mono security update
>                    | patch
> i | libgda-3_0-mysql                  | mySQL Provider for GNU Data Access (GDA)
>                   | package
> i | libmysqlclient-devel              | mysql security update
>                    | patch
> i | libmysqlclient15                  | MySQL Shared Libraries
>                    | package
> i | libmysqlclient16                  | MySQL Shared Libraries
>                    | package
> i | libmysqlclient_r15                | MySQL Shared Libraries
>                    | package
> i | libmysqlclient_r16                | MySQL Shared Libraries
>                    | package
> i | libqt4-sql-mysql                  | Qt 4 MySQL support
>                    | package
> i | mysql-administrator               | A MySQL Server Management,
> Configuration, and Monitoring-> | package
> i | mysql-gui-tools                   | Common Files for MySQL GUI Tools
>                    | package
> i | mysql-query-browser               | A Graphical MySQL Query Shell
>                    | package
> i | perl-DBD-mysql                    | Interface to the MySQL database
>                    | package
> i | php5-mysql                        | PHP5 Extension Module
>                    | package
> i | qt3-mysql                         | MySQL Plug-In for Qt
>                    | package
> i | ruby-mysql                        | MySQL bindings for Ruby
>                    | package
>
>
> [07:44 zephyr/home/david] # mysql
> Welcome to the MariaDB monitor.  Commands end with ; or \g.
> Your MariaDB connection id is 3
> Server version: 5.1.44-MariaDB-log SUSE MariaDB RPM
>
> Type 'help;' or '\h' for help. Type '\c' to clear the current input statement.
>
> MariaDB [(none)]> use mysql;
> Database changed
> MariaDB [mysql]> select user,host,password from user;
> <snip - table is still there>
>
> What in the heck is 'MariaDB' and why did it replace mysql??

MariaDB is the "follow" on project by one of the mysql guys started
after he left Sun because he wasn't happy with the direction and effort
Sun put into mysql after they bought it. AFAIK, MariaDB started with a
branch of the mysql code base just prior to the Sun acquisition.

http://askmonty.org/wiki/MariaDB

> What difference
> does it make to me? I'm sure Maria is a sweet girl, but I was always partial to
> mysql -- What gives?

With mysql now owned by Oracle, who knows how long it'll be maintained.

HTH,
Robert
>

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

C-29
In reply to this post by David C. Rankin
On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 14:59, David C. Rankin
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>        What in the heck is 'MariaDB' and why did it replace mysql?? What difference
> does it make to me? I'm sure Maria is a sweet girl, but I was always partial to
> mysql -- What gives?

MariaDB is Monty's drop-in replacement for MySQL (Monty is the guy who
started MySQL, sold it to Sun, and then got all cranky when Oracle
bought Sun and by extension bought MySQL)

MariaDB is basically a fork of MySQL5.1.

C.
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

C-29
In reply to this post by Robert Schweikert-4
On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 15:07, Robert Schweikert <[hidden email]> wrote:
> With mysql now owned by Oracle, who knows how long it'll be maintained.

Oracle has made a public statement about its commitment to MySQL
http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/042364
Insinuating that Oracle will stop maintaining MySQL is stirring up the
FUD and nothing more.  Oracle had to make clear commitments to MySQL
as part of the EU Commission investigations into the purchase of Sun.

Take a look into what really happened, and the claims made by Mr.
Widenius (primary original author of MySQL), vs the statements made by
Marten Mickos (former CEO of MySQL)... maybe you'll learn something
about the person behind MariaDB.


C.
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
In reply to this post by C-29
On 05/04/2010 08:08 AM, C wrote:

> On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 14:59, David C. Rankin
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>        What in the heck is 'MariaDB' and why did it replace mysql?? What difference
>> does it make to me? I'm sure Maria is a sweet girl, but I was always partial to
>> mysql -- What gives?
>
> MariaDB is Monty's drop-in replacement for MySQL (Monty is the guy who
> started MySQL, sold it to Sun, and then got all cranky when Oracle
> bought Sun and by extension bought MySQL)
>
> MariaDB is basically a fork of MySQL5.1.
>
> C.

Thanks, Robert, Clayton


        It's always a surprise when a bombshell like this drops and your are left
wondering "... not even a peep on the list prior to the update?" "do they think
people just won't notice stuff like this?"...

        I'm good with the fork, but have my own concerns about "who know how long Monty
will be around.." I'm all for OSS over whatever Oracle might try to monopolize,
but when you have built your entire system around a LAMP backend, it is
troubling (to say the least) when M has a sex-change and reemerges as something
quite different than it was 2 days ago.

        What about documentation? Does mysql.org go with Oracle and how divergent will
mysql and mariadb become and how quickly? I can't tell you the number of times I
needed to learn how to do X and I just jump over to the mysql site and go to
chapter Y and in 5 minutes you have your answer. I sure hope Maria continues
with the useful documentation, else-wise she gets real fickle real quick.
       

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
In reply to this post by C-29
On 05/04/2010 08:30 AM, C wrote:

> On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 15:07, Robert Schweikert <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> With mysql now owned by Oracle, who knows how long it'll be maintained.
>
> Oracle has made a public statement about its commitment to MySQL
> http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/042364
> Insinuating that Oracle will stop maintaining MySQL is stirring up the
> FUD and nothing more.  Oracle had to make clear commitments to MySQL
> as part of the EU Commission investigations into the purchase of Sun.
>
> Take a look into what really happened, and the claims made by Mr.
> Widenius (primary original author of MySQL), vs the statements made by
> Marten Mickos (former CEO of MySQL)... maybe you'll learn something
> about the person behind MariaDB.
>
>
> C.

This might answer some of my last questions... (reading now)

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
In reply to this post by C-29
On 05/04/2010 08:30 AM, C wrote:

> On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 15:07, Robert Schweikert <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> With mysql now owned by Oracle, who knows how long it'll be maintained.
>
> Oracle has made a public statement about its commitment to MySQL
> http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/042364
> Insinuating that Oracle will stop maintaining MySQL is stirring up the
> FUD and nothing more.  Oracle had to make clear commitments to MySQL
> as part of the EU Commission investigations into the purchase of Sun.
>
> Take a look into what really happened, and the claims made by Mr.
> Widenius (primary original author of MySQL), vs the statements made by
> Marten Mickos (former CEO of MySQL)... maybe you'll learn something
> about the person behind MariaDB.
>
>
> C.

Troublesome:

2. Non-assertion. As copyright holder, Oracle will change Sun’s current policy
and shall not assert or threaten to assert against anyone that a third party
vendor’s implementations of storage engines must be released under the GPL
because they have implemented the application programming interfaces available
as part of MySQL’s Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.

A commercial license will not be required by Oracle from third party storage
engine vendors in order to implement the application programming interfaces
available as part of MySQL's Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.

Reassuring:

9. MySQL Reference Manual. Oracle will continue to maintain, update and make
available for download at no charge a MySQL Reference Manual similar in quality
to that currently made available by Sun.

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

C-29
On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 15:43, David C. Rankin
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Troublesome:
>
> 2. Non-assertion. As copyright holder, Oracle will change Sun’s current policy
> and shall not assert or threaten to assert against anyone that a third party
> vendor’s implementations of storage engines must be released under the GPL
> because they have implemented the application programming interfaces available
> as part of MySQL’s Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.
>
> A commercial license will not be required by Oracle from third party storage
> engine vendors in order to implement the application programming interfaces
> available as part of MySQL's Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.

You have to love/hate legalese... depending how you read this..
doesn't it seem to lift some of the more draconian Sun restrictions..
and now basically says if you use the API, you don't have to GPL the
result?

C.
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Michael Schroeder-4
In reply to this post by David C. Rankin
On Tue, May 04, 2010 at 08:37:50AM -0500, David C. Rankin wrote:
> Thanks, Robert, Clayton
>
>
> It's always a surprise when a bombshell like this drops and your are left
> wondering "... not even a peep on the list prior to the update?" "do they think
> people just won't notice stuff like this?"...

What mysql update are you talking about?

Cheers,
  Michael.

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Robert Schweikert-4
In reply to this post by C-29


On 05/04/2010 10:01 AM, C wrote:

> On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 15:43, David C. Rankin
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Troublesome:
>>
>> 2. Non-assertion. As copyright holder, Oracle will change Sun’s current policy
>> and shall not assert or threaten to assert against anyone that a third party
>> vendor’s implementations of storage engines must be released under the GPL
>> because they have implemented the application programming interfaces available
>> as part of MySQL’s Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.
>>
>> A commercial license will not be required by Oracle from third party storage
>> engine vendors in order to implement the application programming interfaces
>> available as part of MySQL's Pluggable Storage Engine Architecture.
>
> You have to love/hate legalese... depending how you read this..
> doesn't it seem to lift some of the more draconian Sun restrictions..
> and now basically says if you use the API, you don't have to GPL the
> result?

Yes, if one favors the take, extend, embrace, and don't give back model,
than this is a wonderful change. This change certainly opens the doors
into the proprietary abyss.

Robert


>
> C.

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Philipp Thomas
In reply to this post by C-29
* C ([hidden email]) [20100504 16:02]:

> doesn't it seem to lift some of the more draconian Sun restrictions..
> and now basically says if you use the API, you don't have to GPL the
> result?

And thus opens the gate for the folks that take stuff from the comunity and
never give anything back.

Philipp
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
On 05/04/2010 10:00 AM, Philipp Thomas wrote:

> * C ([hidden email]) [20100504 16:02]:
>
>> doesn't it seem to lift some of the more draconian Sun restrictions..
>> and now basically says if you use the API, you don't have to GPL the
>> result?
>
> And thus opens the gate for the folks that take stuff from the comunity and
> never give anything back.
>
> Philipp

Robert, Phillip:

        +1 ... Exactly!

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

David C. Rankin
In reply to this post by Michael Schroeder-4
On 05/04/2010 09:01 AM, Michael Schroeder wrote:

> On Tue, May 04, 2010 at 08:37:50AM -0500, David C. Rankin wrote:
>> Thanks, Robert, Clayton
>>
>>
>> It's always a surprise when a bombshell like this drops and your are left
>> wondering "... not even a peep on the list prior to the update?" "do they think
>> people just won't notice stuff like this?"...
>
> What mysql update are you talking about?
>
> Cheers,
>   Michael.
>

Michael,

        I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the 'update'
deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I sure in the heck
didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included code somewhere that says
"On the next update, delete mysql and replace it with MariaDB -- and don't make
it obvious to the user."

        I do have OBS-database as a repository and looking at the individual repos,
that is where 'sweet Maria' must have come from. I think you are safe as long as
you don't have the database repo active. (Of course, I could be wrong there -
you might meet her on your next date .. I mean update ;-)

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Patrick Shanahan-2
* David C. Rankin <[hidden email]> [05-04-10 18:50]:
> I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the 'update'
> deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I sure in the heck
> didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included code somewhere that says
> "On the next update, delete mysql and replace it with MariaDB -- and don't make
> it obvious to the user."

Novell ???

Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

L A Walsh
Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> * David C. Rankin <[hidden email]> [05-04-10 18:50]:
> Novell ???
>
> Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?

Doesn't Novell have some final say-so on SuSE, since the first
step to their SLED product?

I'd be surprised if they were not at least on the steering committee
if not some more involved role, considering it's what feeds their
prime linux offering.  I'm not saying it is a good or a bad thing...
just saying... am I befuddled?  

I also noticed it trying to interoperate using
the same new technologies my Win7 box came sprouting.  Some where in Vista,
but I didn't have one of those.  I can't help but think there
might not be some business strategy meetings between MS and Novell --
not necessarily to our deficits, either.  

They appear to be moving
in open standard/open source space, so it would seem to all be for
the good (perhaps to the chagrin of those who don't like the Novell-MS
deal).  But regardless, it would make sense for Novell's OS offerings
to interoperate with MS's offereings -- especially they want to sell
each others products (which I think was part of the deal? No?)  

I certainly don't think that is a bad thing as long as open-standards
are maintained.


-l

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Brian K. White
In reply to this post by Patrick Shanahan-2
On 5/4/2010 7:20 PM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

> * David C. Rankin<[hidden email]>  [05-04-10 18:50]:
>    
>> I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the 'update'
>> deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I sure in the heck
>> didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included code somewhere that says
>> "On the next update, delete mysql and replace it with MariaDB -- and don't make
>> it obvious to the user."
>>      
> Novell ???
>
> Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?
>    

I know, this discussion is hilarious to witness.

People, your systems were not changed by any mystery. Novell did not
make any such arbitrary disruptive change to your system.
OpenSUSE 11.2 updates repo still has mysql and no mariadb in it.

That means if your system changed to mariadb during an update, it was
because you ASKED for this to happen by adding some other repo to your
install sources, and then performed a blind update instead of of
reviewing the proposed update.

So, you went out of your way to add some external repo, and then you
used it irresponsibly, and then you accused Novell of breaking your system.
This is why big companies remove freedoms from the rest of us. Thanks.

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Philipp Thomas
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

On 2010-05-04 17:00, Philipp Thomas wrote:
> * C ([hidden email]) [20100504 16:02]:
>
>> doesn't it seem to lift some of the more draconian Sun restrictions..
>> and now basically says if you use the API, you don't have to GPL the
>> result?
>
> And thus opens the gate for the folks that take stuff from the comunity and
> never give anything back.
>

Well, it is freedom. In many senses and directions. >:-)

As far as I'm concerned, mysql continues to be free and open for us.
If somebody chooses to add (closed?) things of their own that I don't
need nor use, I'm not affected. My side remains the same They are free
to use it for whatever they want.

- --
Cheers / Saludos,
             
        Carlos E. R.
        (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" GM (Minas Tirith))
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Peter Nikolic
In reply to this post by Brian K. White
On Wednesday 05 May 2010 05:44:31 Brian K. White wrote:

> On 5/4/2010 7:20 PM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> > * David C. Rankin<[hidden email]>  [05-04-10 18:50]:
> >> I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the
> >> 'update' deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I
> >> sure in the heck didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included
> >> code somewhere that says "On the next update, delete mysql and replace
> >> it with MariaDB -- and don't make it obvious to the user."
> >
> > Novell ???
> >
> > Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?
>
> I know, this discussion is hilarious to witness.
>
> People, your systems were not changed by any mystery. Novell did not
> make any such arbitrary disruptive change to your system.
> OpenSUSE 11.2 updates repo still has mysql and no mariadb in it.
>
> That means if your system changed to mariadb during an update, it was
> because you ASKED for this to happen by adding some other repo to your
> install sources, and then performed a blind update instead of of
> reviewing the proposed update.
>
> So, you went out of your way to add some external repo, and then you
> used it irresponsibly, and then you accused Novell of breaking your system.
> This is why big companies remove freedoms from the rest of us. Thanks.

One thing i have noticed over the past 18 months to 2 years   is  .. ,,

When someone somewhere in Novelle/openSUSE drops a brick   the first thing
that happens is the buck is passed out to the users  very quickly  , This is
NOT a good way to go  

A little LESS buck passing and a bit more oh S**T we frelled up would go a
long long long way   know what i mean .

Pete     bemused

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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Marcus Meissner
In reply to this post by Patrick Shanahan-2
On Tue, May 04, 2010 at 07:20:40PM -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

> * David C. Rankin <[hidden email]> [05-04-10 18:50]:
> > I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the 'update'
> > deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I sure in the heck
> > didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included code somewhere that says
> > "On the next update, delete mysql and replace it with MariaDB -- and don't make
> > it obvious to the user."
>
> Novell ???
>
> Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?

Actually I think David has server:database added or some other OBS repo.

Ciao, Marcus
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Re: What is 'MariaDB' and what has it done with my mysql??

Brian K. White
In reply to this post by Peter Nikolic
On 5/5/2010 2:55 AM, Peter Nikolic wrote:

> On Wednesday 05 May 2010 05:44:31 Brian K. White wrote:
>    
>> On 5/4/2010 7:20 PM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
>>      
>>> * David C. Rankin<[hidden email]>   [05-04-10 18:50]:
>>>        
>>>> I did an update yesterday and with zypper's or yast's 'magic' the
>>>> 'update' deleted mysql from my system and replaced it with 'MariaDB'. I
>>>> sure in the heck didn't tell it to do that. Somebody at Novell included
>>>> code somewhere that says "On the next update, delete mysql and replace
>>>> it with MariaDB -- and don't make it obvious to the user."
>>>>          
>>> Novell ???
>>>
>>> Are you grasping straws?  Or just flailing out where-ever?
>>>        
>> I know, this discussion is hilarious to witness.
>>
>> People, your systems were not changed by any mystery. Novell did not
>> make any such arbitrary disruptive change to your system.
>> OpenSUSE 11.2 updates repo still has mysql and no mariadb in it.
>>
>> That means if your system changed to mariadb during an update, it was
>> because you ASKED for this to happen by adding some other repo to your
>> install sources, and then performed a blind update instead of of
>> reviewing the proposed update.
>>
>> So, you went out of your way to add some external repo, and then you
>> used it irresponsibly, and then you accused Novell of breaking your system.
>> This is why big companies remove freedoms from the rest of us. Thanks.
>>      
>
> One thing i have noticed over the past 18 months to 2 years   is  .. ,,
>
> When someone somewhere in Novelle/openSUSE drops a brick   the first thing
> that happens is the buck is passed out to the users  very quickly  , This is
> NOT a good way to go
>
> A little LESS buck passing and a bit more oh S**T we frelled up would go a
> long long long way   know what i mean .
>
> Pete     bemused
>    

Actually I have no idea what you mean.
In what way did Novell screw up? Are you claiming mariadb was in the
official update repo and has since been removed?
Short of that, it would be you who is setting the shining example of how
to avoid responsibility at the expense of whoever has the misfortune to
be handy for you to point at.

Also, you seem to assume that since I called a spade a spade and it
happens to involve pointing out that it's wrong to accuse Novell of a
screw up in this case, that this means I am in any way affiliated with
them? I am not. I am a user like anyone. I'm just one who's awake and
doesn't blame Stanley Tool Co. when I hit my thumb with one of their
hammers.

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