Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

PerfectReign
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 19:35, Basil Chupin wrote:

> Kai Ponte wrote:
> http://pag.csail.mit.edu/~adonovan/dilbert/show.php?day=11&month=12&year=20
>05
>
>
> (To save me the trouble of replying to earlier postings concerning the
> format of dates:
>
> I am well aware of the confusion caused by the american practice of
> putting the month before the date. The date of the cartoon is shown as
> "12-11-05" and being an American cartoon but published here in Australia
> (which would have the date shown as "11-12-05") I didn't know which was
> the proper date- so I simply left it as shown in the cartoon. As it
> turns out, the date is in the American format.)

This should probably be OT, but don't most people who use the dd mm yy
practice use dot notation? I remember seeing that often. To use your example,
the date would be written as 11.12.05, is that not correct?

I'm curious also if we Californians (and other US peeps) are the only ones
still using the mm-dd-yy format for dates.

Oh well, off to bed...
--
kai ponte
www.perfectreign.com

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
Kai Ponte wrote:

> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 19:35, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> Kai Ponte wrote:
>> http://pag.csail.mit.edu/~adonovan/dilbert/show.php?day=11&month=12&year=20
>> 05
>>
>>
>> (To save me the trouble of replying to earlier postings concerning the
>> format of dates:
>>
>> I am well aware of the confusion caused by the american practice of
>> putting the month before the date. The date of the cartoon is shown as
>> "12-11-05" and being an American cartoon but published here in Australia
>> (which would have the date shown as "11-12-05") I didn't know which was
>> the proper date- so I simply left it as shown in the cartoon. As it
>> turns out, the date is in the American format.)
>
> This should probably be OT, but don't most people who use the dd mm yy
> practice use dot notation? I remember seeing that often. To use your example,
> the date would be written as 11.12.05, is that not correct?

No, we would normally show it as 11/12/06.


> I'm curious also if we Californians (and other US peeps) are the only ones
> still using the mm-dd-yy format for dates.

The Canadians as well I suspect.

Cheers.

--
When the going gets tough, the tough get SUSE.


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SPAM: Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

James Knott
In reply to this post by Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
Anders Johansson wrote:

> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 14:14, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> Anders Johansson wrote:
>>> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 13:36, Basil Chupin wrote:
>>>> You mean, you mean...nobody has reported this?! Oh my gosh.
>>> I don't know, I haven't checked. But step 1 when filing a bug is to
>>> search bugzilla to see if there already are matching entries, and if so
>>> add a "me too" in it, with the particulars of your system, if they don't
>>> match the ones in the existing report. This can help narrow down the
>>> cause of the crash
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>
>> Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon which I
>> cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If not
>> then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list doesn't
>> accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to insert the
>> jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here. Pity. If you get
>> a chance go to the Dilbert author's site - www.dilbert.com - and have a
>> look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.
>
> It doesn't look like the archive goes back that far.
>
> I'm not sure what you're driving at though. Asking for details about a bug so
> it can be fixed was the subject of a Dilbert strip??
>
> ps. date formats are icky. Does that mean December 11 or November 12? In
> future, please write it out, it's not even a common format in the English
> speaking world, let alone the rest of the world, so on a list like this,
> confusion is dominant
>
>

Or perhaps just post the URL of that Dilbert.


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

James Knott
In reply to this post by Darryl Gregorash
Darryl Gregorash wrote:

> On 01/11/06 09:05, Felix Miata wrote:
>> On 06/11/01 14:42 (GMT+0100) Anders Johansson apparently typed:
>>
>>  
>>> ps. date formats are icky. Does that mean December 11 or November 12? In
>>> future, please write it out, it's not even a common format in the English
>>> speaking world, let alone the rest of the world, so on a list like this,
>>> confusion is dominant
>>>    
>> Writing out isn't necessary if you use the ISO 8601 format, which is like
>> writing ordinary numbers, with most significant digits to the left.
>> 2005.11.12
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_format#yyyy-mm-dd_.28year.2C_month.2C_day.29_-_the_ISO_8601_standard
>>  
> You have no idea of the confusion I cause here when I write a date in
> this format. However, I am slowly educating the masses :-)

I thought ISO 8601 required hyphens, not periods.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Carlos E. R.-2
In reply to this post by Fergus Wilde
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The Wednesday 2006-11-01 at 16:06 -0000, Fergus Wilde wrote:

> > I assume you're referring to Dec. 11, 2005.
>
> Round my part of the world that would be 12 November 2005 - just for clarity,

In mine too.

> given that lots of Europeans and lots of North Americans are on the list,
> might it be good for people to put the month as Jan, Feb etc?  Just a
> thought,

Or iso if numbers only, year in four digit format - remember 2000? That's
what standards are good for, after all.

- --
Cheers,
       Carlos E. R.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
On Thursday 09 November 2006 00:01, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> The Wednesday 2006-11-01 at 16:06 -0000, Fergus Wilde wrote:
> > > I assume you're referring to Dec. 11, 2005.
> >
> > Round my part of the world that would be 12 November 2005 - just for
> > clarity,
>
> In mine too.
>
> > given that lots of Europeans and lots of North Americans are on the list,
> > might it be good for people to put the month as Jan, Feb etc?  Just a
> > thought,
>
> Or iso if numbers only, year in four digit format - remember 2000? That's
> what standards are good for, after all.

No, because then you're back to confusion again. People default to their own
local way of writing dates if you use numbers. If you do, you'd have to point
out explicitly every time that "this date is in ISO format", and in the end
it's just easier and less confusing to just write out the month name in
letters


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

HG-2
Hi!
On 11/9/06, Anders Johansson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Thursday 09 November 2006 00:01, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> > Or iso if numbers only, year in four digit format - remember 2000? That's
> > what standards are good for, after all.
>
> No, because then you're back to confusion again. People default to their own
> local way of writing dates if you use numbers. If you do, you'd have to point
> out explicitly every time that "this date is in ISO format", and in the end

(Getting far away to OT land here...)
I agree with Carlos. ISO format is a standard, so IMO you do not have
to state that the date is according to the standard, rather the other
way around: "this date is no by the standard." :-)

But I do get what you are saying. Except that I believe you are wrong.
If we were to agree that the standard virtually anything else, then it
would be confusing. All "confusing" date that are used seem to start
with either month or day - and you never know which. Or if the year is
expressed with only 2 numbers, then ... well that should not be done
anyways. The ISO format, 2006-11-09, differs clearly from all other
common formats (starts with full year, doesn't use dot or slash) and
therefore doesn't cause confusions. I have never seen a format that
looks like ISO, but has day and month swapped around...
Of course, I might be wrong as I do not know *all* the used date
formats. So you are welcome to prove me wrong. I do not mind.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
On Thursday 09 November 2006 21:53, HG wrote:
> But I do get what you are saying. Except that I believe you are wrong.
> If we were to agree that the standard virtually anything else, then it
> would be confusing.

This sentence is confusing. There seems to be words missing

In any case, the problem is that there are an incredible number of people who
grew up thinking mm/dd was the only way of giving a date, and another
incredible number of people who learned dd/mm was the only way, and they have
all been doing it just about every day of their entire lives. You cannot come
along and say "ok, we will now all do it the ISO way".

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't mind if this worked, because the ISO way is
actually the standard way in Sweden, so for me it would be easy :)

But it just won't ever work, without a massive amount of marketing and
education, which is obviously way beyond the means of a mailing list. You
have a much easier time getting Americans and Brits to use decimal measuring
systems (which can (and will eventually) happen, but not without confusion
and airplane accidents)


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Carlos E. R.-2
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The Thursday 2006-11-09 at 22:13 +0100, Anders Johansson wrote:

> But it just won't ever work, without a massive amount of marketing and
> education, which is obviously way beyond the means of a mailing list.

Ahem! I do my little bit - see my greeting line ;-)

- --
Cheers,
       Carlos E. R.
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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

HG-2
In reply to this post by Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
Hi!

On 11/9/06, Anders Johansson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Thursday 09 November 2006 21:53, HG wrote:
> > But I do get what you are saying. Except that I believe you are wrong.
> > If we were to agree that the standard virtually anything else, then it
> > would be confusing.
>
> This sentence is confusing. There seems to be words missing

Heh, yes there are... but not that many 8-)

> In any case, the problem is that there are an incredible number of people who
> grew up thinking mm/dd was the only way of giving a date, and another
> incredible number of people who learned dd/mm was the only way, and they have

Where do they all write the year? You left that out. I think that you
are actually saying that people will confuse mm/dd/yy with dd/mm/yy or
mm.dd.yy (is that even used?) and dd.mm.yy. And the same with
mm/dd/yyyy and dd/mm/yyyy (as with the dots). Right?
My point: none of those resemble ISO at all. ISO is not going to be
confused with those.

> all been doing it just about every day of their entire lives. You cannot come
> along and say "ok, we will now all do it the ISO way".

Sure we can! ;-)

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