Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Patrick Shanahan
* Darryl Gregorash <[hidden email]> [10-31-06 18:15]:
> Sorry, have no bridges. How about some beachfront property near Alice
> Springs?

Near Anzac Hill ??


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

John Andersen
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Tuesday 31 October 2006 01:43, Basil Chupin wrote:
>  The final 6.10 boots up as a Live version and you then have the
> option of actually installing it on the HD.

Yup, that's also the way it was for 6.01.

I've been trying to download the 6.10 torrent, but inspite of
having 62 peers at least 20 of which have 100% availability
its barely loafing along.

I don't know if Ktorrent 2.0.3 still has issues, or what,
but with that many peers I would expect it to fill my connection
to max bandwidth.  As it is I'm uploading just as as downloading.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

John Andersen
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Tuesday 31 October 2006 04:05, Basil Chupin wrote:
> > Basil, if you are relying on wikipedia as being definitive, I have some
> > farmland to sell you -- about 350 km due east of Sydney :-)
>
> Not interested in farmland--there's a drought you know.

Not where this farm land is.....

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
In reply to this post by John Andersen
John Andersen wrote:
> On Tuesday 31 October 2006 01:43, Basil Chupin wrote:
>>  The final 6.10 boots up as a Live version and you then have the
>> option of actually installing it on the HD.
>
> Yup, that's also the way it was for 6.01.

I didn't know. I had downloaded the 6.10 RC1 and that wasn't a Live copy
so I assumed that the final would be the same- an installable like SUSE
for example.


Cheers.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
In reply to this post by Darryl Gregorash
Darryl Gregorash wrote:

> On 31/10/06 07:05, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> Darryl Gregorash wrote:
>>> On 31/10/06 05:49, Basil Chupin wrote:
>>>> <snip>
>>>> Here is what the wikipedia, in part, has to say about beta version:
>>> Basil, if you are relying on wikipedia as being definitive, I have some
>>> farmland to sell you -- about 350 km due east of Sydney :-)
>> Not interested in farmland--there's a drought you know. But I'm in the
>> market for a good Bridge, preferably with Harbour views, if you have
>> something in this line.

> Sorry, have no bridges. How about some beachfront property near Alice
> Springs?

What's the asking price?


>> I think both you and Clayton are missing the point here. I fully
>> understand and accept that a beta may be unstable and there to be
>> broken (but strangely, every beta of Firefox has performed almost
>> flawlessly; the same I can say about Thunderbird and I am now using
>> the beta1 of v2.0 without any problems [except one very minor one
>> which doesn't affect its daily use]).

> Given the number of open severe bugs I just found in the mozilla core
> alone, I have to say you are very lucky.

Rubbish. Name 50!


>> Before you can find out if the program is unstable or can be broken
>> you must be able to *install* the damn thing. Beta1 won't even install
>> correctly for chrissake! :-) . You cannot even find out what has been
>> installed when you do install it after doing the "workaround" because
>> one of the key components--for which 10.1 has now become infamous--is
>> not installed by the installation module!

> Is Yast not installed?


Yast2 Control Centre is but none of the YOU bits work. Each pretends to
start then suddenly disappears. The YOU Software Management, eg, starts,
states that it is preparing a list of software, announces that it is
Downloading something (?the Source), then poof! just vanishes.

> I won't try to suggest that the problem is a trivial one, because it
> isn't. Beyond suggesting it might be the unintentional byproduct of some
> other bug fix (which probably happens a lot more often than anyone might
> wish to believe), I wont' even speculate how or why it arose.
>
> But that is what you get when you sign up for a beta. If you don't even
> have Yast, the old standby, at your disposal, then yes, it is
> irreparably broken. Is it really that bad?

It's all relative, isn't it? To me, yes, but to some others it's
accepted as a natural occurrence in betas and therefore nothing of any
import.

Cheers.


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
In reply to this post by John Andersen
John Andersen wrote:
> On Tuesday 31 October 2006 04:05, Basil Chupin wrote:
>>> Basil, if you are relying on wikipedia as being definitive, I have some
>>> farmland to sell you -- about 350 km due east of Sydney :-)
>> Not interested in farmland--there's a drought you know.
>
> Not where this farm land is.....

What, Wyalong? Slap bang in the middle of the driest part?

Cheers.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

C-29
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
> Yast2 Control Centre is but none of the YOU bits work. Each pretends to
> start then suddenly disappears. The YOU Software Management, eg, starts,
> states that it is preparing a list of software, announces that it is
> Downloading something (?the Source), then poof! just vanishes.

It's Segfaulting... there are a few bugs open on this.  If you start
YaST form the command line, you get the privilege of seeing the
segfault :-)  Not too helpful if you don't know how to fix it, but it
takes the poof out of what's happeneing.


> It's all relative, isn't it? To me, yes, but to some others it's
> accepted as a natural occurrence in betas and therefore nothing of any
> import.

I wouldn't say it's nothing of any import.  It's something that
absolutely needs to be fix, and as soon as possible... but... the fact
that it exists in 10.2 Beta 1 is not something that should scare you
off until 11.0.  Your earlier comments on Beta 1 made it sound as if
you were expecting a fully functional and 100% working SUSE
release.... something you can and should never expect from a Beta 1
release.  If the same problem is still there in Beta 2 and Beta 3...
then it's time to panic. :-)  Meanwhile... if you are like me and not
able to really contribute to the actual repair work, you do like we
all do.. try it out on a non-critical system... report the bugs... and
provide any additional information the developers need to find the
cause of the problem.  Then in the end.. there's (hopefully) a 10.2
release in December that works almost perfectly.

C.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 12:22, Basil Chupin wrote:
> Yast2 Control Centre is but none of the YOU bits work. Each pretends to
> start then suddenly disappears. The YOU Software Management, eg, starts,
> states that it is preparing a list of software, announces that it is
> Downloading something (?the Source), then poof! just vanishes.

Who are you calling a poof? :)

Anyway, please file a bug for it in bugzilla.novell.com. It sounds as if
something is crashing


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 12:32, Basil Chupin wrote:

> John Andersen wrote:
> > On Tuesday 31 October 2006 04:05, Basil Chupin wrote:
> >>> Basil, if you are relying on wikipedia as being definitive, I have some
> >>> farmland to sell you -- about 350 km due east of Sydney :-)
> >>
> >> Not interested in farmland--there's a drought you know.
> >
> > Not where this farm land is.....
>
> What, Wyalong? Slap bang in the middle of the driest part?

350km *east* of Sydney would be somewhere in the Pacific ocean, I'm pretty
sure that doesn't qualify as dry.


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
Anders Johansson wrote:

> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 12:32, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> John Andersen wrote:
>>> On Tuesday 31 October 2006 04:05, Basil Chupin wrote:
>>>>> Basil, if you are relying on wikipedia as being definitive, I have some
>>>>> farmland to sell you -- about 350 km due east of Sydney :-)
>>>> Not interested in farmland--there's a drought you know.
>>> Not where this farm land is.....
>> What, Wyalong? Slap bang in the middle of the driest part?
>
> 350km *east* of Sydney would be somewhere in the Pacific ocean, I'm pretty
> sure that doesn't qualify as dry.

Aaaah, s***! :-) .

Fell for that one hook, line and sinker :-) .

(Must stop taking those red pills.)

Cheers.


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
In reply to this post by Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
Anders Johansson wrote:
> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 12:22, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> Yast2 Control Centre is but none of the YOU bits work. Each pretends to
>> start then suddenly disappears. The YOU Software Management, eg, starts,
>> states that it is preparing a list of software, announces that it is
>> Downloading something (?the Source), then poof! just vanishes.
>
> Who are you calling a poof? :)

HE knows who I mean, HE knows! :-)


> Anyway, please file a bug for it in bugzilla.novell.com. It sounds as if
> something is crashing


You mean, you mean...nobody has reported this?! Oh my gosh.

(I'm going to go and take a red pill now.)

Cheers.


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

C-29
In reply to this post by Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
> Anyway, please file a bug for it in bugzilla.novell.com. It sounds as if
> something is crashing

Something is crashing... I filed a bug on at least one aspect of
this... and from the looks of it, there are a few others in there too.

C.

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 13:36, Basil Chupin wrote:
> You mean, you mean...nobody has reported this?! Oh my gosh.

I don't know, I haven't checked. But step 1 when filing a bug is to search
bugzilla to see if there already are matching entries, and if so add a "me
too" in it, with the particulars of your system, if they don't match the ones
in the existing report. This can help narrow down the cause of the crash


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
Anders Johansson wrote:
> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 13:36, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> You mean, you mean...nobody has reported this?! Oh my gosh.
>
> I don't know, I haven't checked. But step 1 when filing a bug is to search
> bugzilla to see if there already are matching entries, and if so add a "me
> too" in it, with the particulars of your system, if they don't match the ones
> in the existing report. This can help narrow down the cause of the crash
 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon which I
cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If not
then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list doesn't
accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to insert the
jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here. Pity. If you get
a chance go to the Dilbert author's site - www.dilbert.com - and have a
look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.

Cheers.

--
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  George W. Bush   6 November 2000


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Basil Chupin
In reply to this post by C-29
Clayton wrote:
>> Yast2 Control Centre is but none of the YOU bits work. Each pretends to
>> start then suddenly disappears. The YOU Software Management, eg, starts,
>> states that it is preparing a list of software, announces that it is
>> Downloading something (?the Source), then poof! just vanishes.
>
> It's Segfaulting... there are a few bugs open on this.  If you start
> YaST form the command line, you get the privilege of seeing the
> segfault :-)  Not too helpful if you don't know how to fix it, but it
> takes the poof out of what's happeneing.

So instead of going "poof" it goes "clunk" in front of your eyes, eh? :-)

I'm glad someone has submitted reports on this "poof"/"clunk" phenomenon.


>> It's all relative, isn't it? To me, yes, but to some others it's
>> accepted as a natural occurrence in betas and therefore nothing of any
>> import.
>
> I wouldn't say it's nothing of any import.  It's something that
> absolutely needs to be fix, and as soon as possible... but... the fact
> that it exists in 10.2 Beta 1 is not something that should scare you
> off until 11.0.  Your earlier comments on Beta 1 made it sound as if
> you were expecting a fully functional and 100% working SUSE
> release.... something you can and should never expect from a Beta 1
> release.

Never! I expect very little at all times. My needs are simple.

> If the same problem is still there in Beta 2 and Beta 3...
> then it's time to panic. :-)

Beta 2 is due out next Thursday. What are the odds this problem will be
fixed? :-)

>  Meanwhile... if you are like me and not
> able to really contribute to the actual repair work, you do like we
> all do.. try it out on a non-critical system... report the bugs... and
> provide any additional information the developers need to find the
> cause of the problem.  Then in the end.. there's (hopefully) a 10.2
> release in December that works almost perfectly.

It would be a nice Christmas present all 'round if 10.2 came out as a
functional release.

Cheers.


--
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  George W. Bush   6 November 2000


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Bugzilla from andjoh@rydsbo.net
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 14:14, Basil Chupin wrote:

> Anders Johansson wrote:
> > On Wednesday 01 November 2006 13:36, Basil Chupin wrote:
> >> You mean, you mean...nobody has reported this?! Oh my gosh.
> >
> > I don't know, I haven't checked. But step 1 when filing a bug is to
> > search bugzilla to see if there already are matching entries, and if so
> > add a "me too" in it, with the particulars of your system, if they don't
> > match the ones in the existing report. This can help narrow down the
> > cause of the crash
>
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon which I
> cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If not
> then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list doesn't
> accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to insert the
> jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here. Pity. If you get
> a chance go to the Dilbert author's site - www.dilbert.com - and have a
> look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.

It doesn't look like the archive goes back that far.

I'm not sure what you're driving at though. Asking for details about a bug so
it can be fixed was the subject of a Dilbert strip??

ps. date formats are icky. Does that mean December 11 or November 12? In
future, please write it out, it's not even a common format in the English
speaking world, let alone the rest of the world, so on a list like this,
confusion is dominant


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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Felix Miata
On 06/11/01 14:42 (GMT+0100) Anders Johansson apparently typed:

> ps. date formats are icky. Does that mean December 11 or November 12? In
> future, please write it out, it's not even a common format in the English
> speaking world, let alone the rest of the world, so on a list like this,
> confusion is dominant

Writing out isn't necessary if you use the ISO 8601 format, which is like
writing ordinary numbers, with most significant digits to the left.
2005.11.12
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_format#yyyy-mm-dd_.28year.2C_month.2C_day.29_-_the_ISO_8601_standard
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and I am helped." Psalm 28:7 NIV

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Randall Schulz
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin
Basil,

On Wednesday 01 November 2006 05:14, Basil Chupin wrote:
> ...
>
> Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon which
> I cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If
> not then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list
> doesn't accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to
> insert the jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here.
> Pity. If you get a chance go to the Dilbert author's site -
> www.dilbert.com - and have a look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.

I assume you're referring to Dec. 11, 2005.

Do you know how to see installments older than a month? I can't see back
further than Oct 1, 2006.


RRS

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

Fergus Wilde
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 15:27, Randall R Schulz wrote:

> Basil,
>
> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 05:14, Basil Chupin wrote:
> > ...
> >
> > Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon which
> > I cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If
> > not then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list
> > doesn't accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to
> > insert the jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here.
> > Pity. If you get a chance go to the Dilbert author's site -
> > www.dilbert.com - and have a look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.
>
> I assume you're referring to Dec. 11, 2005.

Round my part of the world that would be 12 November 2005 - just for clarity,
given that lots of Europeans and lots of North Americans are on the list,
might it be good for people to put the month as Jan, Feb etc?  Just a
thought,
Best to all
Fergus
>
> Do you know how to see installments older than a month? I can't see back
> further than Oct 1, 2006.
>
>
> RRS

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Re: Installing 10.2 beta 1: read this BEFORE installing

PerfectReign
In reply to this post by Basil Chupin

On Wed, November 1, 2006 7:27 am, Randall R Schulz wrote:

> Basil,
>
> On Wednesday 01 November 2006 05:14, Basil Chupin wrote:
>> ...
>>
>> Last Sunday in our local 'paper there was the 'Dilbert' cartoon
>> which
>> I cannot but feel captures what may now be happening with SUSE. If
>> not then it is just simply funny. Unfortunately this mail list
>> doesn't accept attachments and I don't think it would be possible to
>> insert the jpg image (I scanned the cartoon) into a message here.
>> Pity. If you get a chance go to the Dilbert author's site -
>> www.dilbert.com - and have a look at the cartoon dated 12/11/05.
>
> I assume you're referring to Dec. 11, 2005.
>
> Do you know how to see installments older than a month? I can't see
> back
> further than Oct 1, 2006.
>
> Google to the rescue...

Check here:

http://pag.csail.mit.edu/~adonovan/dilbert/show.php?day=12&month=11&year=2005

And is that what is happening at Novell? Are they trying the "outsourcing"
joke with their executives?

It still scares me - that the company who tried to shove Novell 4.x down our
collective throats after the brilliance of 3.1x - is in charge of the future
of SUSE.  

--
kai ponte
www.perfectreign.com

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1234